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  • #8447
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Well, here’s my shot at answers. No claim at any authority though.

    Do they see Hrolf start the quest, and then just walk away from the place where the ritual began?

    Yes, but he may be in his hero-light, dressed as the god, etc

    Can they follow him as he walks off over the hills and runs into a group of bandits?

    Yes. It’s in the world, so there’d be no barrier to them tagging along. It’s not without its dabgers though.

    Can they jump into the fight and help him by killing some of the bandits to make the fight easier?

    Yes, but…

    If they did that, would that somehow suck them into the myth?

    I would say this not only possibly, but highly likely. There’s a quest going on, someone following the path and you start joining in on the actions. Hi, thanks, you’re now part of it as well.

    Obviously if the audience is playing a support role by praying and sacrificing, following the quester is out of the question, but what if Henrik just stumbles across the sacred grove where the quest starts, and is therefore not a supporter of the quest? Can he follow along to see an interesting show?

    I would say anyone who tries to just observe is more likely to end up as part of the quest. They may not, (Biturian Varosh didn’t get sucked up in Rurik’s, though the experience was still dangerous), but I would say the chance is very real.

    #8238
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    A quick question

    From the Guide (final peek pdf vol 1, p141)
    “From this turmoil emerged the Red Goddess, intact and woven in the weave of the world. Since then the Red Goddess has been accepted as real and integral to the world of Glorantha.”

    Not sure how accepting the Orlanthi are, but leaving that aside. Did the conflict at Castle Blue, and Sedenya’s victory there, *change* the Great Compromise so that she is part of it?

    #8076
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Scott Martin
    “the outcomes are controversial by the time we approach far-flung Hobby Year 1800.”

    My interpretation (emphasis, emphasis on it being nothing more than my interpretation) of what Greg told me all those years ago is that the ending of the hero wars and the future history thereafter in KoS is just one possibility of many. Further interpreting that (again, just my interpretation), there is absolutely nothing that says your Glorantha (YGMV) has to be headed towards the Zin letters, the hobby years discussion, the illiteracy era, or the society/situation that produced them. My understanding (emphasis again, I could have been wrong) was that the Lunar book I referred to in an earlier message would have shown a completely different future. There was no fixed single ‘canonical’ future which defined the end of the Hero Wars, what happens, who and what survives and what comes after. My interpretation (again emphasis) on Greg’s intention *back then* was to provide two diametrically different outcomes, and let the players/GM choose anything anywhere in between, which could include ruin or prosperity for any or all groups.

    Remember, though, that this is my interpretation of a short conversation from almost two decades ago. So my conclusions may be misleading due to me mis-remembering, poorly interpreting Greg’s intent or there having been changes made since. I have no idea if my interpretation was correct or, even if it was, what Greg’s thinking is now.

    #8063
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Just for information as to where I’m coming from. Back at RQ COn III in Melbourne, 1996, in the Lore auction. Yes, I know how long ago that was and that it doesn’t fall anywhere near the cannon, let alone in it.

    Question “In King of Sartar, the ending is presented as basically that Argrath wins and the Lunars are [virtually] eradicated. You said once that you were thinking of writing a Lunar book and the ending would be completely different, with the Lunars victorious and the Sartarites [the losers]. Are you continuing along those lines?”

    Greg’s answer: “Yes”

    The text can be found on page 24 of Questlines II.

    I asked Greg another time for some clarification which (if my memory serves) ran something along the lines of those two endings would be the ends of a spectrum, and players would then be free to explore a whole range of possible endings for their campaigns.

    That was, of course, 18 years ago and things have changed a lot. I could be running on the remnants of a completely abandoned approach.
    But it’s why I don’t take the ending of the Hero Wars and what comes after, as described in KoS, as pre-ordained.

    #8055
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Martin Helsdon: “Until the Red Moon falls, the Goddess cannot achieve enlightenment as the White Moon.”

    Yes, but that does not require a black and white conflict.

    Peter Metcalfe “The Goddess wants her own destruction.”
    I’m assuming this means much the same as Martin’s statement, not a death-wish on Sedenya’s part. That is, she wants destruction of her current state to move to a new one.

    The White Moon movement shows that there are conflicts in the Lunar Empire over this point. Which gives options beyond a black and white Lunar vs Orlanth conflict. If some parts of the Lunar following might co-operate with the Heortlings in destroying the Red Moon (and the Empire) we are already away from black and white. The next step is what happens after. What possibilities are there for the relationship between Orlanth and the White Moon? That gives clues for a less black and white approach. I know I’m talking very far in the future compared to 1620-25 but it’s the long term that might answer King in Yellow’s question.

    We then get into questions of co-operation across the Lunar/Orlanthi divide. Some Orlanthi might be happy with a transformed Sedenya, depending on what she transformed into. Some will likely want the end of her. Lots of play opportunity in there as the two sides are no longer monolithic blocks and so the diametric opposition is no longer complete. What do your players do when someone on the other side reaches out to them? It might be White Moon followers, Orlanthi worried about fanaticism blind to the consequences, or Ernaldans looking for another way. How do they handle arguments between the hardliners and the compromisers? How do they reconcile whatever their stance is with their mythic position?

    The Empire might have to go, but that doesn’t mean a totally black and white conflict between followers of Orlanth and Sedenya. The possibilities there might hold the answer King in Yellow wants.

    #8048
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Martin Helsdon “the clash between Moon and Storm for the Middle Air is the defining one towards the close of the Third Age. “
    Or
    Peter Metcalfe
    “Orlanth is locked in conflict with the Red Moon but that is one of many enemies that Orlanth has (others include the Dragons, Magasta, Chaos and Zzabur the Godless).
    The conflict with the Red Moon is acute in Dragon Pass because the Lunars have made it so (by being there in force). Elsewhere the Red Moon is a distant threat whose importance is often drowned out by other threats (Fronela – Kingdom of War, Loskalm, King Cong’s Tax Collectors; Ralios – Arkati, Seshnela; Maniria – Greymane, Ramalia; Kethaela – Wolf Pirates, the Print, the Aeolians and the Red Moon; Umathela – Fonrit).”

    They’re not incompatible, as “defining” is not the same as “only”

    But it’s not the scale that I’m wondering about, it’s the solution. Regardless of how important/central/defining the Sedenya/Orlanth conflict is or is not, what solutions can people see that don’t result in destruction on one side and ruin on the other?

    I think Scott Martin gives a hint towards one suggestion:
    “Maybe this is another place where Mr Yellow can go back to find a moment where moon and storm were not enemies but actually brother and sister, or even sweethearts. But after the battle, it’s clear that Orlanth was missing a star and Yelmgatha could see new planets.”
    Any others?

    #8024
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Great News. I’d join a KS for a hard cover version.
    And for the two Sartar books and Pavis as well for that matter

    #8023
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Hi

    While I’ve enjoyed reading the replies (having been interested in Glorantha for 30 years, not the original poster’s three), I think one of King in Yellow’s points has been missed

    “I find the idea that the entire orlanthi culture is locked in some kind of eternal, obsessive conflict with the Lunar Empire and ideology and vice versa very simplistic and not overly interesting.”

    What I interpret him as saying is that the apparent black and white nature of the conflict is not appealing to him as someone new to Glorantha.

    Castle Blue proved Sedenya’s right to exist. Orlanth has had that since the Great Compromise. So while the Lunar Empire (Red Goddess) and Orlanthi (Orlanth) ae currently looked in a death struggle, does it have to be that way? As Ernalda says, there is always another way.

    I’ve wondered if the ‘future history’ in King of Sartar shows what happens if the situation doesn’t change. I’ve often toyed with the idea of running a campaign that goes way beyond 1625 where the challenge for the players is stop that rather dismal future by somehow finding a way out of the current death spiral between Sedenya and Orlanth.

    #7918
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator
    Quote:
    Quote from Jeff Richard on May 18, 2014, 07:45
    The personal runes for gods and concepts are nice descriptive color and are exactly the sort of thing that might be tattooed on a cult member. However, they were more symbols than players and GMs could reasonably be expected to remember and manipulate. There’s a reason that alphabets with 12 to 58 characters proved more popular (and easier to master) than more complex writing systems with hundreds of signs.

    Complex and obscure knowledge are things priesthood have often loved to separate them from the mass of worshippers.

    #7899
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Thanks. At least knowing the timeline and broad outline is as in those books is enough to work with.

    PS I kind of liked the extra runes, if only as descriptive colour. Things that could be used on shrines, votive statues and tatoos.

    #7894
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Thanks for the answers. Just for clarification, how much of “Orlanth is Dead” (and “Gathering Thunder” for that matter) are still canonical?

    #7842
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Personally I like geas that can be broken. To me the point of them is that the recipient has to continually choose to follow the path set down by the God.

    Yes, “Never be a parent” and “Unable to bear/father children”. The second doesn’t strike me as a geas at all. But I think that’s what Simon meant.

    Michael

    #7841
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Thanks all – this has helped. I have one question at the moment though

    Quote:
    Quote from Charles Corrigan on May 5, 2014, 01:10
    An experienced HeroQuester tends to meet some specific opponents again and again, though they (both sides) may not be acting in the precise roles they took in previous meetings and they generally do not recognise each other (very special magic such as the Eye of the HalfBird excepted).

    I’m not sure how this works versus the Heroquest challenge. Given the change in power (and what it says about the Count of Sun County in the example) would the loser of a Heroquest Challenge be able to confront the winner again, or even continue heroquesting (The Count is said to lose most of his rating in his Mastery Rune). OK, if it’s only a specific ability, it’s not as dire. But in the example given it sounds pretty final for the loser.

    #7764
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    Which is the alive but humbled option. I can see the Yelmalion myth running that way

    #7744
    Profile photo of Michael Hitchens
    Michael Hitchens
    Spectator

    I wonder how common “never be a parent” might be as a geas?

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 33 total)

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