Home Forums Glorantha Glorantha Discussions The Seven Shifter Weapons

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    Profile photo of Martin Hawley
    Martin Hawley

    Hi all
    I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas on what these weapons are
    We know that the the Shifter Weapons were wielded by the seven sons of Vingkot before time began and that the Vanak Spear was one of them …anyone have any candidates for the other six?
    and why are there only 7 when Vingkot had nine sons?
    any ideas?


    One weapon would be the bow of Jorganos the Archer, which also features in Garani Whitetop’s defence of Arrowmound.

    If you look more carefully, Vingkot had 5 sons, 4 of them became founders of Vingkotling tribes while the Second Son grew gigantic and led a solitary heroic life.

    The other 5 original tribes were founded by the daughters of Vingkot and their husbands, the later tribes by granddaughters of Vingkot and their star lovers or star captains merging with other groups after the disappearance of original tribes (Lastralgortelli and Jorganostelli).

    Kodig’s Sword (of the Sword and Helm Saga) probably was another of these. The main weapons for Korol and Lastralgor aren’t mentioned in the snippets we have about Vingkot’s sons.

    The Vanak Spear appears to be a Berennethtelli heirloom, rendering the “sons of Vingkot” theory a bit vague, though. Beren the Rider, a Hyaloring, married Redailde, Vingkot’s horse loving daughter, and (same as Elmal) started the foreigner wedding customs.

    Vingkot had seven sons or grandsons in law – Beren and Ulanin the Riders, Porscriptor the Cannibal, Goralf Brown, Kastwall Five, and the star captains Liorn and Forosil who married granddaughters of Vingkot. Maybe the seven weapons ought to be attributed to these gentlemen?

    Profile photo of Peter Metcalfe
    Peter Metcalfe

    Whence the Shifter Weapons? They are not in the book of Heortling Mythology…

    Profile photo of David Scott
    David Scott

    The source of the Shifter Weapons is one of Greg’s unpublished manuscripts, called All Men Should Know This or The Verge of Now or more generally known as Harmast’s Initiation (1998). He read some of this out at Tentacles 2007 at the Friends of Glorantha event, and parts were made available to those who were subscribers.

    Of the Vanak Spear – “One of the Shifter Weapons, wielded by the Seven Sons, before Time began.”

    Profile photo of Peter Metcalfe
    Peter Metcalfe

    Okay, arguing from a position of ignorance.

    I think it unlikely that the Seven Sons are the same as the Sons of Vingkot. In addition to the disparity in numbers, there is also the issue that the powers of the shifter weapons (for example “Eringulf […] cast the Vanak Spear to be the Ladder Spear, and climbed it across the Sky” Fragment 1645 in Tales #7) do not mesh well with the Vingkotling weapons which are more primal and don’t change shape. The power of the Vanak Spear hints to me at a Mostali origin or even the magic contraptions in the Lanbril Cult Writeup rather than the weapons of the sons of Vingkot.

    FWIW (pace Joerg) but the Vanak Spear isn’t a Berenethtelli Heirloom. Rastalulf took it from the Empty Mountain and hails it as his Grandfather (Rastalulf’s Saga in History of the Heortling Peoples). For it to be the Weapon of Beren the Rider, I would expect it to be carried around by the King of the Berenethtelli rather than handed down through the bloodline of a clan chieftain.

    I think instead the Seven Sons refers to a heroband that fought against the Darkness, the Golden Wheel Dancers (who do have some history of transformation).

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